I honestly thought the point of this was to run your opponents clock out. But I actually won this one. I was shocked.
http://en.lichess.org/FbUPSduH
http://en.lichess.org/FbUPSduH
White has a huge advantage in horde games. Once you get the queen and rooks to the last file, It's game over. You use the pawns, knights and bishops to do this.
"White has a huge advantage in horde games. Once you get the queen and rooks to the last file, It's game over. You use the pawns, knights and bishops to do this."
A standard game of horde has black starting with 4 less pawns, and 2 fewer starting on the 5th. In that standard setup like on wikipedia then yes I would have to say white has the edge.
However it is more balanced in the lichess variation. This is a chess version of starcraft. White is the protoss, and black is the zerg. Black has many weak fighters, and white has few stronger ones. White's advantage is minimal if any in this variation of horde. 36 pawns is a formidable force. If black can keep it closed long enough and those pawns creep up the board white is toast. White is literally fighting to survive. There is no black king to target. White starts off on the defensive because black has more space, controlling more squares and having more pieces.
Black has good chances. Both sides do, it is balanced.
A standard game of horde has black starting with 4 less pawns, and 2 fewer starting on the 5th. In that standard setup like on wikipedia then yes I would have to say white has the edge.
However it is more balanced in the lichess variation. This is a chess version of starcraft. White is the protoss, and black is the zerg. Black has many weak fighters, and white has few stronger ones. White's advantage is minimal if any in this variation of horde. 36 pawns is a formidable force. If black can keep it closed long enough and those pawns creep up the board white is toast. White is literally fighting to survive. There is no black king to target. White starts off on the defensive because black has more space, controlling more squares and having more pieces.
Black has good chances. Both sides do, it is balanced.
I agree.
White wins over 70% of regular horde. In the lichess version, white wins around 55%.
Our version is much more balanced than the original version.
White wins over 70% of regular horde. In the lichess version, white wins around 55%.
Our version is much more balanced than the original version.
I don't think its that simple Intelligentdesign, In checkers, both sides have equal positions but its been proven that the first player can always force a win., while in horde, you have two completely different forces and different goals, I'm a firm believer that in horde, one side can always win in perfect play.
That's exactly what he's saying, Bourbon. He's saying that it's *not* like checkers, that the positions aren't equal, but they are fairly balanced.
Sorry i meant to reply to rookie_gto not intelligentdesign :P
Wait no, i WAS replying to intelligentdesign.
Kinda confused now.
Kinda confused now.
http://en.lichess.org/ae0Zmj0IaYfR
Here is a more instructive example, one of my games, on how to throw a wrench into the jaws of the horde before it consumes you. My opponent is not rated that high at horde, but is rated 2000+ in multiple time variables, and is a trophy holder in 3 check, king of the hill, and 960. Overall probably a little bit stronger player than myself, but they seem to still learning horde strategy...
1) A4 is one of my favorite openings in this variation of chess. If a beginner goes ahead and takes that pawn it really really slows down both the A and B files b/c after rook takes often times when the A or B pawn move they leave another pawn open to be captured if a player don't get the concept they will get devoured like in this other game of mine. That is a much more crushing victory vs a lesser opponent http://en.lichess.org/XpRnmAldLiVo
Moves 1-10 pretty standard stuff for this opening in horde, my opponent slowly advanced the center of the board. On the other hand, I was shooting at both flanks and trying to open lines.
Move 11, bishop takes g4. I think trading minor pieces for 2 pawns helps white in this variant. I trade my bishop for 2 pawns.
Move 14, my knight is traded for 2 pawns again this is slightly favorable for me.
Move 16, again I trade a minor piece for 2 pawns! I have cleared out 6 advanced pawns in the last few moves at the cost of my bishop pair and a knight. I have won a small victory already as the black pawns will take forever to become dangerous I have cleared out some of the more advanced ones.
moves 17-22 I ignore the c pawn for my own plans of a rook sac to get my queen behind the pawns!
28 king to d2... black has no threats at the moment, and my queen is undermining the attack.
32 knight takes d2 I only get 1 pawn at this point, but I needed to do something to jam up those rolling pawns
37 by now I have my own passed pawn with a much better chance of promotion than the black pawns!
39 Rook takes c4! after not taking a hanging pawn on c4 for about 5 moves in a row earlier in the game I trade my rook for a guarded one at this point. I must slow those pawns down while I promote.
by move 44 it is becoming clear that the black pawns have run out of steam
On move 50 my opponent resigns from a hopeless position. The 3 pawns on the 8th may as well not even be on the board because they are so slow and out of play. a queen can gobble them at leisure. My original queen, and my king totally stop the more advanced ones. From here had my opponent not resigned my new queen was coming to take the c4 pawn and clean off those advanced pawns that are helpless. I would have finished the game off targeting those 8th rank paws totally wiping black out and living a happy life as a king with 2 wives having successfully defended the position
Here is a more instructive example, one of my games, on how to throw a wrench into the jaws of the horde before it consumes you. My opponent is not rated that high at horde, but is rated 2000+ in multiple time variables, and is a trophy holder in 3 check, king of the hill, and 960. Overall probably a little bit stronger player than myself, but they seem to still learning horde strategy...
1) A4 is one of my favorite openings in this variation of chess. If a beginner goes ahead and takes that pawn it really really slows down both the A and B files b/c after rook takes often times when the A or B pawn move they leave another pawn open to be captured if a player don't get the concept they will get devoured like in this other game of mine. That is a much more crushing victory vs a lesser opponent http://en.lichess.org/XpRnmAldLiVo
Moves 1-10 pretty standard stuff for this opening in horde, my opponent slowly advanced the center of the board. On the other hand, I was shooting at both flanks and trying to open lines.
Move 11, bishop takes g4. I think trading minor pieces for 2 pawns helps white in this variant. I trade my bishop for 2 pawns.
Move 14, my knight is traded for 2 pawns again this is slightly favorable for me.
Move 16, again I trade a minor piece for 2 pawns! I have cleared out 6 advanced pawns in the last few moves at the cost of my bishop pair and a knight. I have won a small victory already as the black pawns will take forever to become dangerous I have cleared out some of the more advanced ones.
moves 17-22 I ignore the c pawn for my own plans of a rook sac to get my queen behind the pawns!
28 king to d2... black has no threats at the moment, and my queen is undermining the attack.
32 knight takes d2 I only get 1 pawn at this point, but I needed to do something to jam up those rolling pawns
37 by now I have my own passed pawn with a much better chance of promotion than the black pawns!
39 Rook takes c4! after not taking a hanging pawn on c4 for about 5 moves in a row earlier in the game I trade my rook for a guarded one at this point. I must slow those pawns down while I promote.
by move 44 it is becoming clear that the black pawns have run out of steam
On move 50 my opponent resigns from a hopeless position. The 3 pawns on the 8th may as well not even be on the board because they are so slow and out of play. a queen can gobble them at leisure. My original queen, and my king totally stop the more advanced ones. From here had my opponent not resigned my new queen was coming to take the c4 pawn and clean off those advanced pawns that are helpless. I would have finished the game off targeting those 8th rank paws totally wiping black out and living a happy life as a king with 2 wives having successfully defended the position
Here is me winning as black vs one of the top 50 horde players. So ya black definitely has a dog in the fight. http://en.lichess.org/PSlJ7vYS4Mup
This topic has been archived and can no longer be replied to.